0:01-6:53: Greetings! As this episode opens, we go from a near-death experience to mocking Neil Gaiman in record time (even for us!). What’s the secret connection between that and Hot Stuff, the Little Devil? And our former president? It’s another episode of WhatAnon theories—they’re better for you than QAnon theories because they’re explicitly made-up and absurd (and have only a quarter of the calories)!
6:53-28:19: Moving on, moving on (nothing to see here, folks, move along): the first three issues of Wasteland dropped of DC Universe Infinite (and on Comixology if you’re tempted and don’t have the service). Yes, the sleeper hit of the late ’80s is here, with stories by John Ostrander and Del Close, more than brilliantly illustrated by David Lloyd, George Freeman, William Messsner-Loebs and Donald Simpson, and we are here to talk about how great it is to revisit these stories again. Also discussed: Plop!, UK comics anthologies, US comics anthologies, the need for them, and the hidden secret behind the U.S. anthologies arguably more horrifying than the stories themselves.
28:19-37:08: Another thing that dropped on DCUI: Who’s Who Update ’87 #1, a five issue series updating the original Who’s Who. Unsurprisingly, we have fond memories of this as well, and we talk about it, the beloved Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe, the recently released omnibi of each, and much more.
37:08-40:49: As for something new, it’s also something we’ve discussed before but The Nice House on the Lake #1 by James Tynion IV, Alvaro Martinez Bueno, and Jordie Bellaire has been officially releasedd now, Jeff read it, and wanted to talk some more about it because it’s a stunner.
40:49-1:00:10: Season one of Jupiter’s Legacy on Netflix ended with a cliffhanger—one we probably won’t see resolved any time soon since Netflix decided not to renew it for season two. Graeme indulges Jeff’s Millarschmertz (my internet’s down but I’m assuming that’s a real term) and discusses what might’ve gone wrong: Graeme thought it looked cheap, Jeff thinks that’s not really a barrier to fans of superhero TV and the problem might’ve been, say, things like The Boys.
1:00:10-1:12:26: Graeme has been a bit tired lately (as opposed to Jeff, who’s just *always* tired) and so has been seeking out unchallenging reading material such as: all of Mark Waid’s Avengers material from 2015; and Mark Waid and Kev Walker’s Doctor Strange; Surgeon Supreme.
1:12:26-1:35:26: Also on the Graeme “Easy Reader” McMillan list? Time Masters! That’s right, the DC series by Bob Wayne, Lewis Shiner, and Art Thibert from thirty years ago. It’s a fun sounding series that harkens back to a different era of the DC Universe with things played entirely too seriiously while also giving a lot of shout-outs to classic DC continuity and connecting with the current (of the time) continuity…which ties in well with what Jeff read on Hoopla this week: Invasion! (Secret No More) collecting the three issue spine to the DC even from the late ’80s, featuring some classic DC stalwarts (Keith Giffen, Bart Sears) and some unique dayplayers (Bill Mantlo, Todd McFarlane). Also discussed: New Guardians, because of course we do.
1:35:26-2:08:42: Trying to talk about something a little more current than comics from 30-plus years—our ongoing struggle recently it seems!—and we talk a bit about the current issue of Immortal Hulk (good!) and the announcement of the next creative team to follow Al Ewing and Joe Bennett (not…as good?). Also discussed—the problem with solicitations giving away too much (or, for the retailers, not enough); a rousing game of “guess the creator’s age”; a discussion of Tim and Ben Truman’s A Man Called Hawken, and Walt Simonson’s Ragnarok and more.
2:08:42-end: Closing Comments! Oh, but fortunately some things never change: look for us on Stitcher! Itunes! Instagram! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for her continuing support of this podcast.Next week: Attention, Citizen! Read Judge Dredd: The Complete Case Files, Volume 26 and join us here for the next installment of….Drokk!!
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https://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts4/WaitWhat320.mp3
I watched Jupiter’s Legacy and thought it looked ok, a lot better than any the DC shows I’v seen. Granted I’ve only seen a few episodes of Batwoman, Teen Titans, the new Superman and maybe something else, anyway they were all serious as a heart attack, looked cheap AF and was poorly acted. I mean sure I guess you could laugh at the ridiculousness of Teen Titans but I never got the impression that it was supposed to be funny. My problem with JL (is it intentional that the initials are the same as Justice League?) was that it was slow and kind of boring, not the production or acting, an “interesting” choice when adapting comic that moved at a good speed by modern standards.
Never cared a lot about the Hulk before Al Ewing did his magic so I’m kind of indifferent to them putting a shit writer on the character, I’ll just drop it and follow Ewing to Venom (another character I’m pretty indifferent about) and see what happens there. It’s probably for the best really that Ewing moves on when he has told his story and doesn’t drag it out even if I’m a bit sad it’s ending.
The charms of the Who’s Who and the Handbook have always eluded me. Generally Gruenwald’s efforts to prune and systematise the Marvel Universe left me cold.
I re-read Invasion! a few years ago, when it appeared in my library system. What I recall is a page in which a couple of Dominator discuss the amazing diversity of humans. I think six humans were shown on that page, four white, four male…
The last thing I saw John Severin draw was a Witchfinder series. It was very good. Dark Horse still had the Howard licence then. I briefly entertained hopes of another Kull story.
Neither of you were Captain Canuck readers, or bothered with the Mantlo Jack of Hearts story? Surely Jeff read the Alan Moore written story Freeman drew? Clayface is sad because he thinks his mannequin girlfriend is cheating with Batman…
I’m seeing $200 million for Jupiter’s Legacy??? Is that like $10 million more an episode than Game of Thrones? Steven DeKnight left midway, troubled production. dubya-tee-actual-eff. This was even worse than Millar’s work beclowning itself for a mass audience. It’s all moot anyway, we live in a world where Mark Millar is rich.
Marvel Age #1 has an article on the Handbook and it’s process. It’s all true, this was meant to have an encyclopedic quality. Rubinstein was meant to make a Bill Sienkiewicz world and a Herb Trimpe world simpatico*, according to Gruenwald. Gruenwald’s 3 criteria for artistic selection or how he and Elliot Brown, the type setter and resident scientific expert, worked out how to make superpowers “logical” are the mild highlights.
*I’m paraphrasing.
The two of you really got me interested in Wasteland, so I’m going to have to track that down. Alas, it came out before I was ready for it. As I started moving away from superhero comics, I remember getting into DC’s random 3-4 issue prestige-format minis. I think that’s where I encountered Andy Kubert for the first time. The one that stood out to me was Psycho by Dan Brereton.
I remember reading Invasion before I knew anything about the DC universe aside from Batman and Superman. I think someone had given me issue 3, and then I went and scrounged the other two from a back issue bin. It helped that Todd McFarlane drew the first issue. I remember being taken aback by many of the concepts in there. That Martian Manhunter scene you mentioned was one. Another was that in his disguise, he unknowingly gives himself a marking indicating a high rank in that society. And that alien scientist is so ecstatic with the work he’s done, he thinks his people will bestow upon them their greatest honor–a name. That might come off as trite and cliche nowadays, but to kid me I was just impressed with the worldbuilding. “Oh, right, these aliens aren’t just the bad guys; they have their own culture.” I’d be curious to see how it holds up. I probably hold it in such high regard because at the time I couldn’t parse the DCU stuff, and that just made it feel so much richer and deeper than what it probably was.
As for Jupiter’s Legacy, I hate to say this, but like Jeff I felt the series could have been a little more Millar-y. I understand they were adapting the main series and the prequel series, but man, that cliffhanger should’ve come in the middle of the season. Giving the pacing of the show, it felt like they would have needed 3 seasons just to finish it. I thought Ian Quinlin had a breakout performance, and I would’ve watched a whole show with just his character, he was that charming. To me the show suffered from trying to emulate too much what J.J. Abrams does with his Mystery Box BS instead of just getting us to enjoy the characters do their thing, which is what I like about The Boys. (Of course, I’ll watch anything with Karl Urban in it.)
Just curious about Jeff’s lukewarm reaction to Simonson. I couldn’t figure out which Simonson he was talking about: Simonson the artist, the writer, or the writer/artist. Too me they each have their strengths and weaknesses, but I feel Jeff is more meh on the Simonson the writer (or writer/artist) than the just the artist.
My understanding is that slot machines can only have media properties on them if they’re old enough and not aimed at children (e.g. it’s “nostalgic”). There are, for example, Batman slot machines, but they’re based on the live-action Adam West show or The Dark Knight movie and a Superman slot machine based on the 1970s movie. Other comic/cartoon characters that have had slot machines include the Flintstones, Pink Panther, Garfield, and Popeye. (The Simpsons, Family Guy, South Park, and Dilbert are more “recent” series that have had slot machines, but they’re, at least theoretically, aimed at adults.)
Also, all this information could be outdated by now!
I suspect that today’s young comics readers are probably having better horror comics experiences given that various Junji Ito panels and shorts are among the comics content I see most shared on social media. These are frequently from people I don’t think of as comics readers.
On Wasteland, it’s great, but I think one of the keys to it’s power is that it fits into an 80s/90s trend of DC exploring the post-Underground Comix landscape. You can probably draw a straight line from Slow Death/Skull to Wasteland to the Paradox Press Big Book series.