00:01-06:01: Greetings from Graeme “Whole Day” McMillan and Jeff “Poor Guy” Lester! Graeme is medical emergency adjacent; Jeff is Jeff; nevertheless, we decide to persist in the face of adversity and press on to discuss…attempted murder!!!!
6:01-41:33: Yes, at Graeme’s insistence, Jeff ended up watching the first season of DC Unscripted, the reality show on DC Universe that tracks ten contestants’ attempt to pitch a new reality show for DC Universe. (Suspiciously meta premise, that.) We discuss our reactions to the show, the actual winners, 360 activations, slide lines, ringers, and much more.
41:33-50:59: So, yes, after discussing how unlikely it would seem that someone would watch a DC Universe reality show, Graeme comes clean as “genuinely, non-ironically a fan of” Marvel’s Hero Project on Disney+! So, ya know, what do we know, really?
50:59-58:28: “At a certain point,” Jeff says, “we have to talk about Animal World.” And because Graeme has no idea what Jeff is talking about when he says that, that point becomes immediately after Jeff gets through saying it. Discussed: Animal World, Gambling Apocalypse Kaiji, Unlimited RPS, Deadpool, and much, much more.
58:28-1:23:40: Finally busting out the comics-as-comics talk, we discuss the first nine issues or so of Dan Slott’s run on Fantastic Four, since Jeff finally girded up his loins to read them and…oof. Discussed: A fascinating piece of pre-FF #1 fanfic concerning Sue and Ben’s relationship (in Fantastic Four #5), the FF as family, the appeal of inoffensive comics, functional families vs. dysfunctional families, and more.
1:23:40-1:52:50: Remember when we were talking about the reading list Jeff keeps, and Graeme went, “yeah, hey, I should do that,” and then was all, “hey, I did it!” and then was like, “no wait, it’s not complete I’ll read it to you next time?” THAT TIME IS NOW. (Jeff also reads his reading list, but more for a comedic contrast than anything.) Also discussed: Narrative exhaustion, working oneself sick, being young, a thought about old Rockstar Games video games that I don’t think I got to finish?, Jeff watching Graeme’s old cat, Luna, and more.
1:52:50-1:58:56: All the grousing about narrative aside, Jeff really wants to recommend An Invitation From A Crab, a manga from indie Japanese cartoonist Panpanya. Jeff busts out a lot of great creators—Kafka!, Woodring!, Miyazaki!—in his flailing around trying to convey what’s so great about this collection of stories. It’s very good!
1:58:56-2:14:59: And Graeme has spent a lot of time, when not reading Birds of Prey comics for work, reading Justice League comics from the late ‘80s, early ‘90s. Tune in for an analysis of the days of Giffen, DeMatteis, Jones, Jurgens, and more. Also discussed: the discrepancy between one title between runs; mutant orgies; and more.
2:14:59-end: Closing Comments! Well, it should be but somehow we go directly from giant robots to Bobbie Gentry? Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes!Instagram! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for her continuing support of this podcast. (Also, don’t forget about Spotify!)
Early trick? Infrequent Treat? Either way, Wait, What? Ep. 187 is at your doorstep, dressed up this year as “Sexy All Things Considered”! This episode is two and a half hours of Graeme and Jeff sonically toilet-papering comics’ house, and you’re invited to hide in the bushes and snicker with us!
(For those of you reading this who don’t have Halloween in your location, I hope that paragraph was more charmingly surreal than vexingly impenetrable.)
Anyway, let’s get on with those show notes, shall we? This year, they’re dressed up as “Sexy Medical Consultation Notes”!
00:00-13:47: Greetings from Jeff “I Am The Devil!” Lester and Graeme “Yes, He Is The Devil” McMillan, who are off and running almost immediately thanks to some pressing comic book questions, like: was the Son of Satan actually, y’know, the son of Satan? Discussed: J.M. DeMatteis, The Defenders, Buddha and Anti-Buddha, The Twentieth Century Satans, the David Bowie with the least amount of Bowie Flavor, the world’s meekest defense of Elvis Costello, Marvel’s recent BOGO sale, Iron Fist, Power Man, and Power Man & Iron Fist, and more. “Patient’s autonomous reflexes are responsive…especially the sexy reflexes!”
13:47-34:59: But still tho: Iron Fist. Jeff has been re-reading from Iron Fist’s debut in Marvel Premiere #15 and so as you can imagine we discuss: Iron Fist, the Marvel premiere of Iron Fist (in Marvel Premiere), the career of Pat Broderick, the episode when Jeff suffers a stroke on-air, the penciling debut of Larry Hama and some of the visuals that get carried over to G.I. Joe, Tony Isabella as Gerhard Schnobble, Batroc The Leaper, the origin of Ghost Rider, Seeker 3000, Crystar’s comrade in arms Beau Bridges, Mag-NEET-oh vs. Mag-NET-Oh, the origin of The Champions, Jimmy Woo founding member of the Defenders, and etc. “Patient’s seems dazed and only partially responsive to questioning…unless the questions are sexy and provocative!”
34:59-1:02:43: But of course a big deal about early Iron Fist stories is it’s where a certain Chris Claremont gets his first ongoing series (and with John Byrne, his first regular collaborator) and just like with Hama, it’s pretty damn interesting to see how much of Claremont’s interests, obsessions, and tropes are here in nascent form and how much of them are just…there, right from the get-go. Discussed: softball, creator cameos, mind control, the success of Spider-Man eyes, Bill Everett and Amazing Man, Batroc The Leaper as Pepé Le Pew, Chris Claremont’s scripts, what made the X-Men sell and sell and sell, Claremont and his desire to create tiny little stories about people, how everyone in the cast powers up and the bionic arm reveal in Iron Fist #3, Neil Conan NPR Reporter and Moira McTaggert, Peter Corbeau, more about Jo Duffy on Power Man and Iron Fist, Kerry Gammill, Trevor Von Eeden, Bob MacLeod on New Mutants vs. Bill Sienkiewicz on New Mutants, and much more in that vein. “Veins and pulse rate are shallow…except for the sexier veins. MROWR!”
1:02:43-1:17:16: “I want to spin us around entirely differently,” Graeme announces, “and say did you got to the store this week?” Jeff hasn’t, and technically neither has Graeme but thanks to the miracle of digital downloads and comp copies, he’s here to talk about one of his favorite books of the week, Justice League #45 by Geoff Johns, Francis Manipul and Brian Buccellato. “You have this absolutely ridiculous plot and this astounding art, and I just finished it being like ‘why can’t Justice League *always* like this? This is amazing!’” SPOILERS for this arc, The Darkseid War, and also SPOILERS for Brian Hitch’s opening arc on Justice League which Graeme is also enjoying. Also discussed: Geoff Johns tropes, The Amazo Virus, old rumors from the time of Final Crisis, Jeff Lemire and Justice League Dark, Jeff Parker and Justice League United, “Even Cowgirls Get The Plants,” and more. “Conjunctivae pink. Sclerae anicteric. Oropharynx clear…and hotter than a barbecue pit in July!”
1:17:16-1:22:14: “You know what I’ve been enjoying more than anything?” Graeme asks, but thank goodness it’s a rhetorical question because Jeff doesn’t know. “Bad Machinery.” Discussed: yup, you guessed it: Bad Machinery by John Allison, a comic that Graeme says is “perfectly tuned to my sense of humor and my sense of the ridiculous,” the template for Bad Machinery cases, and SPOILERS for the upcoming volume from Oni, The Case of the Lonely One(and what Jeff does not say but should have is that Graeme would probably like him some Daniel Pinkwater). ” No cyanosis, clubbing or edema…except for *erotic* edema!”
1:22:14-1:28:03: As becomes clear from the conversation that follows, Graeme has not read Jeff’s review of The Colonel of Two Worlds,( and Jeff is okay with that!) but he has read the comic itself, so the duo are able to discuss that very fun and strange freebie comic. Discussed: the importance of unjustified ridiculousness, the new sincerity and the new irony.” This area was mildly indurated. There was absolutely no erythema or fluctuance and it was not tender at all. No drainage…except for the *love* drainage!”
1:28:03-1:49:12: Although he did not get to the store, Jeff did read a lot of comics and he wanted to talk about Captain Marvel #35-46, more or less by Steve Englehart and Al Milgrom. This period falls right after the stunning run by Jim Starlin and, being buds and partying pals of Starlin, Englehart and Milgrom have big shoes to fill but also a semi-sympatico sensibility (and with that I’ll just collect my Alliteration Award at the window and be on my way, thank you very much)…or do they? Discussed: The Lunatic Legion, dropping acid in the Negative Zone, The Trial of the Watcher, the Skrull version of the MacArthur Genius Grant, the secret origin of Captain Marvel, space mules, how the storyline should’ve ended, Field of Dreams, and more. ALSO ALSO: If you want to read a little bit more about how less than spotless this run is, Jeff uses the letters pages as an example here. “1+ posterior tibialis bilaterally. Feet are warm and capillary refill a bit slow but still less than 2 seconds. Decreased hair…which suggests sexy waxing! (Or hair loss.)”
1:49:12-2:00:51: Really, we should be just about done, right? Well, no, not quite: Jeff, knowing how much Graeme has had to write about Star Wars recently, asks Graeme about…Star Wars! And yet, Graeme doesn’t quite take the bait and pivots instead to discuss…Back To The Future Day! Also discussed: the impeccable craft of the first Back To The Future movie; Jeff’s suspicions about Back To The Future and Forrest Gump, Graeme’s criticism of how Back To The Future 2 steals the thunder of Back To The Future 3; Graeme’s criticism of Jeff’s theory, especially in light of the villain of Back To The Future 2 being deliberately modeled on Donald Trump, FULL SPOILERS for Back To The Future 2, shooting sequels back to back and whether that can work with movies that aren’t books, and more. “Heart is Regular rate and rhythm without murmur, rub or gallop except for intermittent pangs…OF SEXY LOVE.”
2:00:51-2:27:48: “I like how we were actually ‘let’s talk about Star Wars’ and we totally didn’t,” sez Graeme, and so we finally do. Discussed: The release schedule for Star Wars movies, Greg Rucka’s Journey To Star Wars—The Force Awakens miniseries (and Graeme’s review), whether the new movie would be more satisfying the less you know about it, J.J. Abrams *KEEPER OF MYSTERIES*, Star Trek Into Darkness and Graeme’s rewatch and Jeff’s refusal to believe anything Graeme says now, rewatching Man of Steel vs. rewatching Green Lantern, rewatching Avengers vs. rewatching Avengers Age of Ultron, the good moment from The Phantom Menace, why Jeff likes John Cassaday on Star Wars and why Graeme likes Stuart Immonen on Star Wars, and more. “Possible abnormal chest xray. Will repeat today….over a romantic candlelight dinner in the nude!”
2:27:48-close: Closing comments! Our special thanks to the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios for their continuing support of this podcast..as well as our special thanks to the Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy…and to all 112 of our supporters on Patreon who make all this possible. Stitcher!Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr!
NEXT WEEK: Another skip week since there were five Thursdays this month and the very last Thursday is right before Jeff’s birthday so…yes, no podcast next week and blame Jeff for that.
HOWEVER, did you read all of the roundtablebetweenGraeme, Matt, and I about the first issues of Paper Girls, Survivors’ Club, Batman & Robin Eternal, and Doctor Strange? It’s like a podcast for the eyes! It’s worth a read! We had a lot of fun doing it and will probably want to do more!
ALSO, on Friday, Graeme and Jeff are special guest-stars on the only movie podcast in the universe, Travis Bickle on the Riviera! We are on part two of the massive Spookstravaganza where Sean Witzke, Travis Stone, and an unstoppable super-team of cinematic smartypants look at the film of Ridley Scott versus the films of Tony Scott! Go check out Part 1 so you can be prepared for the sonic chair match that is Graeme vs. Jeff vs. Sean vs. Tony Scott’s Domino!!!
ALSO ALSO, Secret Convergence on Infinite Podcasts starts this week so keep an eye out on the Secret Convergence tumblr so you can catch the first crossover at Fan Bros featuring our very own Graeme McMillan!
It looks like the auto-embedding of the player is back so look to our first comment if you need a link for cutting and pasting needs. And as always, thank you for listening!
I had these plans, right? Since I’ve been doing some reviews of comics elsewhere on the internet (as Jeff described in his way-too-kind introductory post, below), I’ve been fortunate enough to wind up receiving some…
http://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts/WaitWhat162.mp3 First things first! Those of you who just want the direct link to the podcast for copying and then pasting for downloading however you choose, PLEASE SEE THE FIRST COMMENT . (So, technically, it’s…last…
Thanks to Gar Berner for Bringing The Super-Awesome!
Damn it, next year we’re going to have a contest centered around Graeme’s first Prog Rock album, The Moog Goo of Guy Pan or something because it’s quite a bummer to have my mug staring out from this post exclusively.
Anyway. Once again, I have managed to go an entire night without sleep so let me apologize in advance for the dozens, if not thousands, of errors, typographical and otherwise, sure to pop up in this post. (Also I need to get better at screenshotting Avengers pages.) Things should improve scheduling-wise after this, and I can go back to make dozens, if not thousands, of errors, typographical and otherwise, for other reasons.
Ready for some show notes? Some serious no-fooling two and three-quarters of an hour bare-knuckle podcasting? Well, then. I have just the thing for you!
00:00-40:51: Greetings! Cue up your Lonely Man Theme but don’t be fooled: even though we start by talking about the Incredible Hulk TV show, it takes a certain amount of time to get around to the comic book. But instead we stick to the TV side of things, with discussion of Tales of the Gold Monkey, B.J. and The Bear, and most especially Twin Peaks (and its return!). I’m going to point you to Graeme’s thoughts on the topic, with a touch of Abhay’s since we reference them in the convo but they’re definitely worth being reading on their own. We also discuss the TV show Manhattan about the building of the atomic bomb, The Making of the Atomic Bomb by Richard Rhodes, and, of course, Gavin & Stacey and the current season of New Girl. And if that wasn’t enough non-comics talk for you, we also talk about Jeff’s strange relationship with iPhones, old and new. Also also discussed: hatewatching things, artisanal douches, and babies and, uhhhhhh, what else do we usually talk about? Hmm… 40:51-57:09: Comics books! That’s right we eventually remember to talk about comic books! In fact, first off we dig deep into Batgirl #35, by Cameron Stewart, Brenden Fletcher and Babs Tarr. Tossed out there in our discussion; Gail Simone, Bob Haney, the phrase “evil 4chan DJ,” target audiences, and more. It’s a bit of a tussle, this discussion. 57:09-1:09:55: Graeme received copies of Trinity of Sin #1 by J.M. DeMatteis, Yvel Guichet, Jason Gorder and Gabe Eltaeb; Earth 2: World’s End #1 and #2 by more people than I’m getting paid to type; and Klarion #1 by Ann Nocenti and Trevor McCarthy; we also tussle a bit on this one, too. Tussle! It’s one of the all-time great words.
Also great is how Graeme calls me out on my shitty handling of percentages. (Wait, is that great?) 1:09:55-1:24:01: Changing gears a bit, Jeff feels there’s been a certain maximalism in comic books lately, a serious commitment to spectacle and too much. And never is that more true than with Transformers Vs. G.I. Joe #3 by Tom Scioli and John Barber. (Please note that we also tussle briefly over the public reaction to Seven Soldiers #1.) This tremendous and overwhelming book pretty much blew our tiny minds. Discussed: Copra, Kirby, Steranko, outsider art, and more. 1:24:01-1:59:18:Avengers Talk!! It’s time for Avengers Talk! This time we are discussing issues #227-250 by (mostly) Roger Stern, Al Milgrom, and Joe Sinnott. It’s almost impossible to talk about this title and not also talk about Marvel in the early Eighties and the heyday of the Jim Shooter editorial era. A really great run of issues with some tremendous steps forward in its handling of female characters (as embodied by Monica Rambeau, the new Captain Marvel). In fact, it’s possible to see the two issue wrap up of Spider-Woman’s book (issues #240-241) as a non-fucked-up version of Avengers #200. And of course, since issues #228-229 has to do with the redemption of Hank Pym, we once again revisit the handling of Hank Pym, the issues and meta-issues, the rewriting of history (comic book history and real life history); a brilliant connection Graeme makes about “yes, and” improvisation and the work of Steve Englehart; Spider-Man, Wife Beater; Tony Stark, Super-Lush; Kirby’s Eternals and Starlin’s Titans; and then… 1:59:18-2:14:01: Something is happening at Jeff’s door so he has to run away for a moment, and comes back and terrifies Graeme. And then we’re back to talking about Maelstrom, Al Milgrom and Joe Sinnott, and much, much, MUCH more.
Oh, and remember how I said I was terrible about screenshots? Look at the stuff I thought was worth showing you guys:
Hawkeye namedropping Tom Stoppard!
and
Dr. Doom! Subpar rapper!
and:
Al Milgrom: Prophet of Pop Culture to Come! (Shame about the spelling, though…)
2:14:01-2:33:41: So. Remember when we said we could wrap this up in under two hours?
Turns out, there’s still the overdue discussion of the winners of our “Are You Feeling The Feeling That I’m Feeling” giveaway! This has a lot of us reading entries and just laughing aloud—maybe not our most professionalmoment—but we wouldn’t have if the work wasn’t so awesome. Because we are laughing all over these amazing entries, you’ll probably get a better bang for your buck reading them all below. Thanks for everyone who entered! We are terrified by how much funnier you guys are than us, and yet we’re the ones talking on air.
The stunning entries by our amazing listeners:
Gar Berner:
“If You’re Not in the World That’s Coming, I Don’t Wanna Be There (Lila’s Song)”
Matt Sabonis:
“Milk for Midnight (for Oreos in Bed)”
Chris Mastrangelo:
1. Can’t Comb My Beard Without You Babe
2. Cold Waffles At Midnight
3. It’s Raining (In My Heart)
4. Tonight’s The Night, Unless It Isn’t, In Which Case Tomorrow Night May Be The Night
5. Rapping Intermission
6. Your Chicken And Tomatoes
7. Taxidermist of Love
8. Don’t Make Me Wrassle Your Heart
9. Snaky Woman
10. A Sexy Little Lady Called Sex
11. Greensleeves [traditional]
12. This Jazzy Sax Solo’s For You
Dave Clarke [the lost entry!]:
1. List heavy show notes
2. Love is a savoury waffle
3. Your chicken and tomatoes
4. Rapping Intermission
5. Portland (feat. DJ Ernie and MC Gus-Gus)
6. I don’t care what people say (I like me some Tony Daniel)
7. Is this thing recording?
8. By the miracle of the internet
9. Download code
10. Sing us out
Christopher Beckett:
3. Ghoulash – Little Bits in the Sauce
4. Babe, I’m Your One Man Army Corps
5. Gimme That Kenny G.
6. We Are Human … Like An Animal
7. Pinky Winehardt Goes to Washington
8. Smooooooooooth
9. I Hear You In My Dreams (& it scares me)
10. Push and Pool
11. A Lonely Heart Gathers No Moss
12. Heart U 4Evah
Derek Moreland/Nathaniel Quietly/Voodoo Ben:
1. “Erotic Vampire LOVE Heist”
2. “You Wafflin’, Baby”
3. “The Cleanse”
4. “FEELINGS!”
5. “Your Chicken and Tomatoes”
6. “Rapping Intermission”
7. “Binging (Delillo) (feat. Lisa “Left Eye” Lopez)
8. “U R My Malomar”
9. “MmHmm MmHmm MmHmm / Interesting”
10. “Booty”
11. “The Cleanse (Remix) (feat. Missy Elliot)
12. “Cinema Mortalis” (instrumental)
Paul Spence:
Baby Has Her Biscuits in The Oven And Her Buns In My Bed
She Feels Like A New Man Tonight
How Can I Miss You If You Won’t Leave Me
You Can’t Have Your Kate and Edith Too
She Got The Ring And I Got The Finger
I Keep Forgettin’ I Forgot About You
The Pint of No Return
Please Bypass This Heart
The Wait What Waffle Window Wonton Watusi
Brendan O’Hare:
1. Hot San Francisco Mornings
2. Am I Leavenworth Your Love?
3. Skip This Track (If You Ain’t Makin’ Love (Right Now))
4. Pause Like I Know You
5. R U Glad I Didn’t Say Banana? ft. Prince
6. Rapping Intermission
7. The World Through Rose Color Asses
8. I’ll Be the One to Be the One
9. Takes All Kinds
10. One at a Time
11. Take it All One at a Time
12. Your Chicken and Tomatoes
Hidden Track: No Stinky Fish
Stu West:
(Just a) Love-Struck Honky
Quiche for One
Ever-Approaching Grandpa of Love
Paul Kupperberg Blues
Bonus track from David Wolkin:
“Graeme unintentionally dropped the best entry on the podcast: ‘My Individual Issues’”
Bonus Show Notes only track from David Wolkin (because my phone lost his text for four days): “Also: ’She Beatboxes, I Drop a Few.’ You guys write this shit yourselves!”
And, as a bonus bonus, here’s Voodoo Ben’s transcript of that “Behind The Music” hatchet job they did on me. (They got most of it right, but man the stuff they got wrong still steams my clams):
Welcome back.
In 1993, Jeff Lester was on top of the world. His soothing R&B rhythms and clever lyrical wordplay were providing a clear and contrasting antidote to the rising grunge movement, and frequent (so would say continuous) airplay of his smash hit single “Your Chicken and Tomatoes” dominated the nation’s airways. Anticipation for Lester’s debut album was so high, in fact, that he was invited to perform the hit on that year’s MTV VMAs.
It was a surprise to everyone when, instead of breaking out what would become his signature tune, Lester instead chose to perform the melodic, more soulful “Erotic Vampire LOVE Heist” that evening. The emotional, heartfelt performance was met with only muted applause by a confused audience. It would be the first of several missteps that would eventually torpedo the once promising musician’s career.
Can You Feel the Feeling That I’m Feeling? released at number 17 on the Billboard Music Charts, with “Your Chicken and Tomatoes” slipping out of the top 100 a month after the album debuted. Supporters praised the album’s deft mix of R&B sound with literary, food, and comic book references – but it was too little, too late. The VMA backlash proved more than Lester could bear. He became disenchanted with “the scene”, as he referred to the industry, and pushed for “Cinema Mortalis”, an instrumental track totally at odds with his R&B sound, to be released as the album’s second single. (His producer, Babyface, fought for the much catchier “MmHmm MmHmm MmHmm/Interesting”, but was overruled by the artist.) It proved the final nail in Lester’s musical career. “Cinema Mortalis” was soundly ignored by the audience, and Lester vowed never to record again – a rising R&B star whose flame burned out too quickly.
See? Not a single word about the debacle that was my cameo on Family Matters! Galling.
2:33:41-2:46:03: Graeme gives us a preview of the amazing work you can now see on our Tumblr, leading to an all-too-brief conversation about the genius that is Bob Haney, and some of the weirdness about Marvel’s NYCC announcements. 2:46:03-end: “We got so far away from saying goodbye.” No, it’s not a song from Jeff’s album, that’s something we actually said. (Wolkin’s right, we do write this shit ourselves!) And it’s a sign that we really do need to be going. But, let us not forget: Tote bags! Places to look for us at—Stitcher!iTunes!Twitter!Tumblr again! and, of course, on Patreon where, as of this count, 82 patrons make this whole thing possible. (And where our $10 and up patrons just got an exclusive video podcast from the Waffle Window!)
Okay, here’s the link. No idea if it’ll turn into a magical noise-playing thing so I’ll also add the link in a comment below all this nonsense so you can get to listening!
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