0:01-7:07: Greetings from Jeff “Bottle Episode?” Lester and Graeme “Clip Show!” McMillan! Yes, due to a very unique October for us, this is being recorded a week in advance! We start off by discussing some tendered suggestions about follow-up episodes for Graeme’s more elliptical comments.
7:07-33:48: Graeme has a couple things to ask Jeff on the eve of NYCC: Graeme knows about the end of Jeff’s convention going days….but what about the beginning? What was the first con Jeff attended? Discussed: Willie Ito; Terry Austin; the odd business of selling movie stills; comic book adaptations of movies; Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band; and more.
33:48-1:09:34: Jeff has a question for Graeme: since Graeme is familiar with both the 100 page Giants of the ‘70s, and the British Marvel anthology titles of the ‘80s, what would be his pick for titles for similar reprint books (with some new material) for DC, Marvel, and another publisher? Discussed: Morrison and Porter’s JLA; Chip Zdarsky’s Spider-Man; Jack Kirby’s 2001: A Space Odyssey; The recent Titan Books reprint of The Prisoner by Kirby, Englehart, and Kane; comics that don’t age well; Finder by Carol Speed McNeil; and more.
1:09:34-1:24:04: Graeme mentions 2000 A.D. as a science fiction themed anthology, which leads Jeff to wonder about a horror anthology where there are recurring characters. So crazy it just might work? We talk about some of the big successes (and many, many failures) of horror comics with recurring characters. Discussed: The Ghost Rider; The 13th Floor; John Constantine; the Castle Rock TV show; fan service and the Gotham TV show; and more.
1:24:04-1:35:02: Jeff managed to get his wife to watch the Justice League movie with him. Why would he do that to his spouse?! Why would he do that to himself!?! Discussed: Justice League; The Avengers; Guardians of the Galaxy 2; Captain America: The Winter Soldier; and more.
1:35:02-2:13:49: Since we’re talking superhero movies and which ones we found better or worse than others, Jeff asks Graeme: top five comic book superhero movies? Top five comic book movies? Also discussed: upcoming untitled Deadpool film project for December; Dark Phoenix and the X-Men movies; the Spider-Man movies; and more.
2:13:49-2:23:58: And since we’re talking about the Spider-Man movies, we talk about…Spider-Man! But maybe not in the way you would expect.
2:23:58-end: Closing comments! (But also: CheeWees!) Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes!Instagram! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast. And then we’re out!
NEXT WEEK: Baxter Building! Read issues #397-405 of Fantastic Four by Tom DeFalco and Paul Ryan and join us!
0:01-20:26: Greetings from Jeff “We Must Talk About Batman’s Penis” Lester and Graeme “Really, Jeff?” McMillan! We get right to the meat of it immediately, and talk about the appearance of “Lil Wayne” in Batman: Damned #1 by Brian Azzarello and Lee Bermejo, DC’s attempt to do a Mature Readers label featuring characters you can still buy underoos of. How’d that turn out, you might wonder if you had no access to the Internet until now? We are more than happy to enlighten you, even as we struggle to keep the double entendres to a minimum. Also discussed: Dongtor Manhattan; DC’s decision to automatically censor the book; and more.
20:26-33:43: Jeff worries if between this, Ben Percy being yoinked from Nightwing, and the three month delay after the rejection of the art for Justice League Odyssey if DC is returning to some bad habits they had foresworn before Rebirth. Discussed: all of the above, and Dan Didio getting a bad rap, the artist lineup on DC’s Age of Heroes book not even a year in; whether the Nightwing controversy would’ve landed harder without Marvel’s Vision controversy; what fans want from Nightwing and what DC gives us with Nightwing; and more.
33:43-1:10:35: On what Jeff suspects is a related note, Graeme has a quick spoiler-free bit of feedback about Heroes in Crisis #1 but not before we discuss what’s going on with Nightwing these days, especially as presented in the pages of Batman #55 by Tom King and Tony Daniel. Then we turn back to Heroes in Crisis and the fates of midlevel heroes we’re roughly grouping here under Wolfman-era New Teen Titans. From there we go on to discuss the return of Wally West in DC Rebirth #1, and to what extent that return is a signal of a need for “loose” continuity or “tight” continuity, to what extent the DCU “self corrects,” and with a bit of a comparison to what’s going on over at Marvel with regards to their continuity issues, especially with regards to the current Infinity Wars event.
1:10:35-1:21:08: And, relatedly, Jeff picked up Thanos Wins by Donny Cates and Geoff Shaw, and Cosmic Ghost Rider #1 and #2 by Cates and Dylan Burnett, which he thinks ties in to some of these ideas about continuity, what works, and who it works for.
1:21:08-1:39:28: Don’t get him wrong, there are comics that Jeff really liked last week and he runs through them briefly here: Immortal Hulk #6 by Al Ewing and Lee Garbett; Mister Miracle #11 by Tom King and Mitch Gerads; Avengers #8 by Jason Aaron and David Marquez; Batman #55 by Tom King and Tony Daniel; The Seeds #2 by Ann Nocenti and David Aja; and most of the first volume of Seto Utsumi by Kadzuya Konomoto. And in celebration of the Killraven Masterworks arriving on Comixology and DC potentially completing the digitization of Kirby’s Kamandi, there’s a brief bit of comparison and contrast between the two. They start off a little closer than you might think? Come for the comparison, stay for the re-creation of a McGregor-Russell Killraven issue.
1:39:28-1:47:39: And while we’re comparing stuff, did you ever notice that Smokey & The Bandit is pretty much just a wacky remake of Vanishing Point? Also, Jeff saw Her and thinks Graeme would like it, but Graeme in inclined to disagree.
1:47:39-2:07:41: And as long as we’re talking movies—the footage from The Joker film! That Captain Marvel trailer!
2:07:41-2:12:13: Closing comments fakeout #1!! Graeme has a quick review of Wonder Woman: Earth One, Vol. 2, by Grant Morrison and Yanick Paquette.
2:12:13-2:15:56: Closing comments fakeout #2! There is a direct sequel to Judge Dredd: Trifecta starting in 2000 AD prog #2100.
2:15:56-end: Closing comments! Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes!Instagram! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast. And then we’re out!
NEXT WEEK: We are…pretty sure we will be back next week? Stay tuned!!
http://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts2/BaxterBuildingEp41.mp3 Previously on Baxter Building: Forget about your previouslys, because this episode we’re jumping through the years to cover four different annuals we’ve left untouched until now, from 1985 through 1991. What is time, anyway…?…
0:00-50:13: Greetings! We are right into it because we have a lot to talk about! Because Dan Coyle demanded it, we are going to talk about the entire run of Star Brand from the 1980s. But first! Jeff has to talk about The Defenders. the eight episode miniseries on Netflix that is the culmination of Marvel and Netflix’s strategy for the last three years. Full spoilers as Jeff vents, decries, and bemoans the experience. SPOILERS for the full series as we discuss not only it, but the two seasons of Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, a little bit of Iron Fist, the Inhumans IMAX flick, and even the Punisher trailer (see above).
50:13-1:03:11: Also, on Netflix: an American adaptation of genuine manga classic Death Note directed by Adam Wingard! While less worthy of Jeff’s ire, it has some very interesting adaptation choices he cannot stop fixating on, and so I guess it seemed like a really good idea to share with you here? (It beats livetweeting, I guess?) (Lakeith Stanfield, tho!)
1:03:11-2:09:31: But then finally…there was nothing else for us to do but finally discuss Star Brand, Jim Shooter’s flagship title for his burgeoning New Universe line back in 1986. Fortunately[?] for us, all of Shooter’s issues, as well as the follow-up stories by various writers until John Byrne steps in to steer the book from issue #11 until its end, are collected in two trades by Marvel, and we are here to talk about *all* of it. Discussed: Jim Shooter and his remarkable take on morality and sex, the difference between supporting characters who seem based on real people and people who don’t, Bobbie Chase’s amazing annual, the “rules” of the New Universe, The Greatest American Hero, South Park, The Pitt, and much, much more.
2:09:31-2:33:10: So much more, in fact, that Graeme has supplemental material about the New Universe, including an overview of Spitfire and the Troubleshooters, a fun fact about Strikeforce: Morituri, the Quasar epilogue issue, and of course…much, much more. And then…
2:33:10-end: Closing comments! Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast.
Next week: Wait, What? Ep. 232! Look for it on Labor Day U.S.A., Monday!
0:00-25:58: Greetings! We are right off to the races, thanks to the some very sub-standard Dr. Strange comics, in particular the Roy Thomas/Gene Colan issues the Dr. Strange Epic Collection: A Separate Reality. Although we bring it up immediately, we get around to talking to them only after discussing other topics like talking in the third person, buying comics in the PDX, bad math skills, and more.
25:58-30:46: And what did Jeff read before he read the sub-par Dr. Strange comics? The tail end of the Claremont/Cockrum run on Ms. Marvel! “Were you being masochistic as shit?” Graeme asks, and it’s a sensible question! Jeff has little more to say than, “save me from bad comics, Graeme!”
30:46-35:37: In the interests of trying to save Jeff, Graeme mentions the Kamandi Special that just came out collecting the last two issues of the original run that’d been produced but never published. Also, Graeme has been reading old comics but *loving* them! Loving them! Graeme has been re-reading old Legion of Super-Heroes issues, the Mr. Miracle Special from the ‘80s by Evanier and Rude, and Showcase #100, a comic from the ‘80s that Graeme and Jeff have been shown love for here on the broadcast and go on to do so again, and Batman and the Outsiders Annual #1, featuring The Force of July, right-wing superheroes who believe the left-wing media is controlling the media. As Graeme so aptly puts it: “Someone’s got to bring back the Force of July. They are primed for a comeback!”
35:37-1:40:32: And Graeme’s also read Cullen Bunn’s Aquaman run, a run Graeme is not as enthusiastic about. And that leads us to talk about the unevenness of Bunn’s work in terms of when he’s good, he’s very good, but when he’s off, he can be pretty terrible. We talk about him, Jeff Lemire, and writers who turn out Big Two comics that do little more than nod at other comics…which leads us to talk about X-Men comics, and what it would take for us to really come back to the title (or titles), how Marvel treats its writers these days, the upcoming third Black Panther related title, the current arc in Detective Comics with Batwoman, Kate reading the Rebirth trades, Monsters Unleashed, Wild Dog and the Wild Dog Special (and the lost storylines of Action Comics Weekly and Marvel Comics Presents), the diversity of DC Comics back in the ‘80s, and more tangents than you can tan an agent with.
1:40:32-2:25:24: And so, somehow, we come to briefly discuss the season finale of The Good Place (which Graeme loved and Jeff has not seen) and then, at some length, the finale of Sherlock (which we have both seen and both, uh, have many thoughts about). SPOILERS for the Sherlock finale (you are very, very safe with The Good Place). Also discussed: the previous season of Who, creator swagger, Crazyhead on Netflix, the three seasons of Line of Duty on Hulu, and the return of Nashville to CMT and Hulu. And then we return for a quick round of comic book shoutouts before…
2:25:24-end: Closing comments! But first: We make a plan for a January podcast episode! Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast.
Next week: Next week is a skip week! Give your ears a well-deserved vacation, read issues #238-247 of Fantastic Four, and then join us in a fortnight for the next episode of Baxter Building!
[Please note: although we talk about so very many comics in this episode, I decided to pull images exclusively from the brilliant Transformers vs. G.I. Joe by Tom Scioli and John Barber. I accept full responsibility and apologize for any resulting cognitive dissonance.]
0:00-21:06: Greetings from your tech-confused team (or as Graeme suggests far too late for our actual opening, RiRi Lester and Victor Von McMillan), who are dealing with a strangely loud recording. Adjust your volume to taste, and buckle up, buttercup, as we start in on almost immediately on the exciting world of comic news (Marvel edition). We cover Marvel’s announcements for its forthcoming Marvel Now! launch (a new Invincible Iron Man, a new Infamous Iron Man, new Champions title, U.S. Avengers, etc.,), the timing of their information release, etc. Discussed: all of the above, plus: Jeff misunderstands Graeme’s use of the word singularity and so just parrots Graeme’s point; a casual invitation for a tech-talented Whatnaut to put the movie Interstellar to good use; Marvel has never had a black female writer ever; David Walker getting backing at Marvel; and more.
21:06-43:42: A bit more about Iron Man, which Jeff has not been following at all, but Graeme as a reader is a little concerned that the teases that Bendis made when starting the book less than a year ago are already set to either be truncated or abandoned. Discussed: abandoned storylines; Captain America: Agent of Hydra and Marvel editors and Marvel creators literally saying whatever they want, even if it bears no relation to reality, just to sell a book; Dr. Doom in name only; whether one of the characters in the Champions is a spoiler; and more.
43:42-50:11: After covering Marvel’s outwardly confident movement toward its next nonboot, and DC’s more conciliatory, albeit coded, approach to Rebirth, Graeme wonders if Marvel’s strangely rushed and off announcements have a lot in common with the DC You marketing blunders, which thank goodness at least gives us a little bit of time to talk about Midnighter by Steve Orlandao and ACO, which Graeme fully spoils but also makes sound very satisfying and great. Also discussed: Black Canary; liking books enough to stick around; Bourne Identity Aquaman; and more.
50:11-58:26: “You’re not reading the DC Rebirth books, right?” asks Graeme, gently, hoping to avoid a prime Jeff rant. And that almost kind of works? But Jeff has read the first two issues of Batman by Tom King and David Finch; but Graeme is really onboard with Aquaman after the events of the second issue. Also discussed: the second issue of Batman, Jeff’s frustration and Graeme’s theory about the last page reveal; and more.
58:26-1:10:46: Graeme went on a back-issue spree at his excellent local store Cloud Nine Comics where he purchased almost the entire run of Hawk and Dove by Barbara and Karl Kesel, so Graeme gets to recap the history of the original Hawk and Dove, the second team from the late ‘80s, the very, uh, offbeat conclusion to the series, and a lot of discussion about DC’s Armageddon 2001, an event DC does not seem particularly keen to reprint and which *dove*tails with the end of Hawk and Dove. Also discussed: Armageddon: The Alien Agenda; Zero Hour; and the punting of Captain Atom’s next series.
1:10:46-1:35:01: The other title Graeme of which bought a lot of back issues? Marvel Fanfare, the prestige paper anthology/inventory title edited by Al Milgrom; “Every issue is an oddity,” is how Graeme describes it quite nicely but wow, some of these oddities! An Angel story by Ann Nocenti and David Mazzuchelli, to name just one! Also discussed: 80s Marvel vs. 70s Marvel; the delight that is the art of Tony Salmons; Trevor Von Eeden in the ‘80s which, of course, makes it all but impossible to avoid bringing up Dick Giordano, Robert Loren Fleming, and Thriller; an amazing Jim Shooter anecdote about Bill Sienkiewicz; spitballing new and exciting Patreon extras; Jim Owsley’s promotional material for The Falcon; and, hoo boy, more.
1:35:01-1:40:39: And what’s Jeff been reading? He’s re-read and didn’t quite finish the remarkable Transformers vs. G.I. Joe by Tom Scioli and John Barber, having only made it up to issue #10 on this particular go round, but he has many positive things to say including the statement, “Transformers vs. G.I. Joe is the Paul’s Boutique of comic books.”
1:40:39-2:00:52: Unfortunately, Jeff was not nearly as impressed with Dark Night: A True Batman Story by Paul Dini and Eduardo Risso that he picked up on the long-ago recommendation of a certain nameless someone whose initials are Graeme McMillan. Part of the problem is clearly Jeff’s expectations for the book, which is not entirely fair to the book, but there are other problems at work, insists Jeff. Discussion ensues! (To the point of uncomfortable stridency on the part of Jeff.)
2:00:52-2:01:54: By contrast, Jeff read The Colonel Corps, the second issue of promotional DC/KFC (KFDC?) comics starring Colonel Sanders and the DC multiverse. He thought it was pretty good!
2:01:54-2:29:14: And finally, to wrap up this edition of “Jeff’s Bad Faith Adventures,” after railing about the way the launch of Comixology Umlimited treated creators, he…signs up for Comixology Unlimited? Jeff, what is up with that? But also: what’s the deal with Comixology Unlimited? Discussed: searching on Comixology Unlimited; Doc Savage Archives Vol. 1; As The Gods Will; the generosity of Chris Arrant; Hoopla (which, contrary to what Jeff says, will allow him to borrow graphic novels now); and more.
2:29:14-end: Closing comments, but with some bonus bits of commentary from Graeme about “Not Brand Echh”! Look for us on Stitcher!Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr, and on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast.
Next week: Skip Week! There are some crazy reasons but join us in two weeks for the next episode of Baxter Building, where we’ll be discussing issues #160 to #170 of the Fantastic Four!
http://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts/BaxterBuildingEp16.mp3 Previously on Baxter Building: With #125, Fantastic Four permanently lost both of its creators. Yes, almost two years after Jack Kirby jumped ship, Stan Lee also moved on after proving that he really couldn’t…
http://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts/BaxterBuildingEp15.mp3 Previously on Baxter Building: Just when all seemed lost, Archie Goodwin saved the day by stepping in as guest-writer on the series in mid-storyline and demonstrated that there was life in the Fantastic Four…
Whew, what a quickly spinning world we live on. As I write this, it was exactly a week ago that Edi and I touched down in Portland, Oregon for a whirlwind visit that, once again, had me missing Rose City Comic-Con by thisssss much. And now here I am typing up the notes for the second in-the-flesh Wait, What? podcast. 185 episodes, and only two of which were recorded with the participants in the same room? Verily, this is the Mighty Wait, What? Age of Hikikomori, True Believer! (Sorry, I’ve been reading too many Roy Thomas introductions recently.)
Without further ado…let’s do, shall we?
00:00-08:41: Greetings from Graeme “On The Street Where You Live” McMillan and Jeff “The Call Is Coming From Inside the House” Lester who dare you to figure out the strange secret of this episode’s recording! [Hint: we recorded it live in the same space, which is why it sounds so different.] [Spoiler: that was really more of a spoiler than a hint.] [Addendum: And that was really more of a hint than a spoiler.] [Postscript: That was actually an addendum, though.] Once again, we are recording live but this time there is no professional microphone to help us, just two men hunched around a single laptop, so we apologize for the slightly less great sound. But for now, settle in and relax as we try out introductions, Graeme tells a story from the recent Rose City Comic-Con, we try to determine how many people hate Graeme, and more.
teeny image!
08:41-25:43: For example, here’s a story about the two of us shopping at Cloud Nine Comics in Portland, Oregon, where one of us was the very model of restraint, and the other one of us was Jeff. Mentioned: Steve “The Stinker” Englehart; whether or not Englehart is still in Oakland, California; whether to eat the brain or the liver; sitting adjacent to Chris Claremont; Englehart’s Coyote and the last cover thereto; meeting pros at cons (wait…is that deliberate?), Graeme’s amazing and entirely accidental pantomime; the ideal price for back issues; Jeff’s visit to Cosmic Monkey Comics; comic t-shirts we have worn and are wearing including these amazingbeauties; and more.
25:43-48:02: Talking about Cosmic Monkey conjures memories for both Graeme and Jeff of Comic Relief in Berkeley, which leads us down the primrose path of memory about how intimidating it was for us to shop in Comic Relief in Berkeley and Comix Experience in San Francisco; being slagged off by comic store clerks; being slagged off by comic store customers; and then back to talking about all the comic book stores in Portland and San Francisco, and what it’s like to live in a city with only one comic book store; which one of us had a “quitting comics” phase and which one didn’t; how living close to a comic book store can help you transcend superhero comics; and more.
Wait, Watch?
48:02-1:10:51: “Hey, why don’t you talk about your Steven Englehart comics?” Graeme asks, so of course we talk about the announcement of Ta-Nehisi Coates writing Black Panther for Marvel. We also talk about the less-covered news of Frank Tieri writing The Black Knight (and Catwoman!); who’s more important to DC, what’s-her-name or what’s-his-name; the news from DC, including the cancellation of Doomed, the un-cancellation of Omega Men, and whether or not the Internet has as much faith in DC as DC has in the Internet. Also discussed: the first issue of Omega Men and whether or not it needed to be more clear; the first issue of Watchmen; the mastery of Dave Gibbons; and more.
1:10:51-1:22:29: Comics we’ve read recently! Sure, we can talk about those! But first let’s talk about reading said comics on the Kindle, because Jeff bought Graeme a copy of the Skull the Slayer collection for the Kindle and Graeme had….problems. Is the Kindle really a digital comic book platform at all? And what did Graeme think of Skull The Slayer? Also discussed is the Kindle version of Super-Villains Unite, Marvel’s collection of the old issues of Super-Villain Team-Up.
It sounds like a weird braggy innuendo, doesn’t it?
1:22:29-1:41:34: In fact, here’s Jeff discussing those very same issues of Super-Villain Team-Up! Learn what you’re (probably not) missing from Victor Loves Namor, the romance comic about two characters who can’t stand each other, as written and drawn by creators who can’t stand them, either. Also discussed: Jim Shooter as writer and artist; Steve Englehart and the guest-star to end all guest-stars; the secret connection between Dr. Doom and Batman; Reed Richards eating his own hair; the crossover that points to a coup; the coup that leads to a new President of Ecuador; and more.
1:41:34-1:52:45: Graeme has read Klang!: A Writer’s Commentary by Priest about the making of Q2: The Return of Quantum and Woody from Valiant. Discussed: Bill Cosby and Mark Waid; transgender in the scripts but cis gendered in the art; dropped plotlines and characters; gossip and process; unreliable narrators; Power Man and Iron Fist, and more.
1:52:45-end: Graeme also quickly mentions the 2000 A.D. jumping-on issue (Prog 1950) that he read and reviewed here on the site, and then is kind enough to lead us into… Closing comments! Stitcher!Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! Matt! Tumblr! And, of course, on Patreon where, as of this count, 109 patrons make this whole thing possible!
Since WordPress isn’t automatically converting all links into the audioplayer, we’re going to leave the first comment to you and allow anyone who needs to to cut and paste from directly below:
Hey, sorry for the delay. Here’s my late post! Please don’t let it make you miss Graeme’s awesomeness below, yeah? I have to say: I’m very happy with the corner I’m painting myself into these…
1:09:34-1:24:04: Graeme mentions 2000 A.D. as a science fiction themed anthology, which leads Jeff to wonder about a horror anthology where there are recurring characters. So crazy it just might work? We talk about some of the big successes (and many, many failures) of horror comics with recurring characters. Discussed: The Ghost Rider; The 13th Floor; John Constantine; the Castle Rock TV show; fan service and the Gotham TV show; and more.
2:13:49-2:23:58: And since we’re talking about the Spider-Man movies, we talk about…Spider-Man! But maybe not in the way you would expect.
Recent Comments